12/6/05 KMOX RADIO RE VP REDEV
MOPR Notes: MM's transcription of the CHARLIE BRENNAN Show on 1120 AM Radio on 12/6/05 - between about 9:30 & 10am, 20 mins were devoted to VP; listening until 11am nothing more was said. > Initials used below in addition to Initials & Abbrevs on MOPR's I&A Page: CB = Charlie Brennan, GB = Gene Blandford, GK = Glenn Koenen.
12/6/05 KMOX - Sec 1 of 7
CB: We're gonna go from uh Pastor...on KMOX, to E.D. or the possible use of it in VP. What's that all about? We'll give u an update. They had a mtg last night. We'll talk about it next on KMOX. (ads, etc) CB: Last night, the VP BOA voted 5 to 0, with 3 ald abstaining, to approve a Resolution calling for a Preliminary Funding Agreemt between the city & Sansone Group & uh we're gonna get into some of those details when we continue. (weather, etc)
CB: Charlie Brennan on the Voice of StL. There was action in VP last night. The BOA approved a Preliminary Funding Agreemt between the city & Sansone Family Holding Co in connection with the redev of a limited portion of the city referred to as the New Town Redev Area. Gene Blandford is the VP Planning Consultant & mgr of redev planning for VP. He joins us on the line right now. Mr Blandford, tku very much for doing so. Good morning, sir!
GB: Tku Charlie, actually I'm uh I'm the Mgr of Redev & Planning for Peckham, Guyton, Albers & Viets (PGAV). We're a planning consultant firm. CB: I see, so u are THE consultant to City VP, correct? GB: That's - yes sir. CB: That sounds good. Tks again & I'm sorry for uh, uh the mess (dash?) up there. Well, lemme ask u, what, what's gonna happen in VP?
GB: Well, ultimately something nice happens in VP. Uh the, the city for a long time now, has uh, uh invested a - uh some money down there with the completion of their levee & that, that pro- project is, is nearing completion now. & I think uh the city is at a point in time where uh they've got a lot of decisions to make uh on what happens in uh the New Town (there?).
CB: How about uh the, the final goal? Is this retail or is this uh a comm or residential or just what? GB: Well, I think, I think at this point in time uh we're still trying to figure that out in, in some respects. The city - in addition to uh, uh the redev of New Town, the city's going thru a Comprehensive Planning process that uh they're looking at a lot of their redev issues thruout downtown er thruout the entire town & in a - in the new town, the downtown area there, u're inside the levee, um I think there's a - there's a possibility for a mix of all 3 of those types of uses (in that area?).
CB: So we're just not sure YET exactly what the end-goal is? GB: Right - well, uh we know that uh - we know that uh the Sansone Group has submitted a proposal & uh to show uh portions of the area possibly - possible to being redev'd for industrial use & uh comm use where it's aprop. But there are a lot of other issues down there that they have to uh, not only the Sansone Group, but the city has to resolve uh to make uh the area uh, um, um more productive & that, that means better access, uh, uh, uh better infrastructure, roads & sewers & those sorts of things. & the city is working thru that process as uh they go fwd.
12/6/05 KMOX - Sec 2 of 7
CB: & right now we've got Glenn Koenen with the Circle of Concern located in VP. He has a uh food pantry in VP & uh from what u see according to preliminary maps is that uh of the 17K sq ft of land that u own, all but about uh 700 would go to uh relocating utilities & widening roads, right, Glenn? GK: That's correct, Charlie, we would lose basically 98% of our property & more importantly, we'd lose the location that's close to where the majority of families that need our help LIVE. CB: So are u willing to sell at some price? GK: We're willing to relocate IF there's a place to relocate to. That's our big concern. It's not just for us but for the families we're helping.
CB: GB, Can we take care of GK & the Circle of Concern? GB: Well, I uno I think at, at this point in time, uh, uh it, it's a little bit premature to be talking about specific props down there with respect to what's going to happen to them. One of the discussions - & I know uh the Circle of Concern is - they're on StL Ave. One of the discussions for a long time has been how this access with traffic circulation along both StL & Marshall Ave occur! & until we get a better resolution uh with that & discussions with StL Cnty, because that's a StLCnty uh, uh road, uh to try & figure out what happens there, it's a little premature to talk specifically about individual prop uh, um along there, especially StL Ave. & when he talked about uh the majority of his prop being taken, I'm not sure exactly what plan he's talking about.
GK: Well, we're looking at the Sansone Map which shows that StL Ave is widened from 2 lanes to 4 lanes, the intersec is moved to the north & a right-turn land is added. So bec- basically it goes from a 2-lane road to a 5-lane road & then when u move the utilities like the sewer lines, the water lines, the gas lines away from the new pavemt, u wind up coming north even further into our prop. GB?: Well - GK: Basically, that map, which was given out in the proposal, shows about 98% of our prop going out of existence!
GB: Well, & the city is considering that proposal at this time, so at this point in time, that the city is considering that, but 'n NO MEANS has the city adopted any plan that is going to acquire anyone's prop. All they've done is enter in uh to an agreemt with the uh Sansone Group to try &, &, & put together a package of props that they have - that uh can be redev'd & it's the early stages of the process.
CB: Do - do - do uh - do u, Glenn, think it's too early to start talking about your prop? GK: Actually I don't because normally, a charity would want 3 to 5 yrs to plan a capital campaign & move to a new location. Under the Sansone Proposal, they're talking about doing this within a yr or 2. They're talking about moving at a very fast rate of speed. Their own proposal, their timeline, would have our bldg being demolished next Summer for the utility relocation.
12/6/05 KMOX - Sec 3 of 7
CB: Mr GB, It doesn't sound like it's too early to start talking about HIS prop. GB: Well no, I, I don't think it's too early to have to, to THINK about HOW uh relocation packages are put together for individual bizs or how uh, uh - I know u mentioned E.D., how E.D. uh HOW & WHEN it can be used. It's a little difficult at this time to talk about the WHERE it will be used or WHY it will be used but, to the basic how & the when of it will be used as a muni is uno quite aprop to be discussing at this time.
CB: Well let me ask u then, uh IF for example, GK & the Bd of Dir of the Circle of Concern Food Pantry DON'T wanna sell under any conditions, at any price, uh would the City VP consider using E.D. to um basically give him fair-market-value for their prop?
GB: Oh, uh, uh at, at the point in time when E.D. would be used, I think uh it would - it would only be used as a last resort & I think everyone from uh the, the mayor & everyone at the city has expressed that it will ONLY be used in the um, the - as a last resort & (in any?) situations where it's aprop.
Uh, uh but to, to specifically say that the Circle of Concern's prop is something that the city is even considering looking at or a devr is, is ready to go in & buy at this point in time - CB: So - GB: I don't think it's _ - CB: but E.D. IS POSSIBLY on the table - GB: Yeah, _ - CB: for a - GB: _ - CB: project which u admit u, u don't know what u're gonna do, but already this private prop owner HAS a purpose, has a mission, owns the prop?
GB: &, & I agree &, &, &, & no one has said at this point in time that his prop is, is, is ready uh to be brought in. I mean he may have gotten an OFFER from Sansone but ALL that has happened up to this point is that Sansone is looking to try to consolidate prop. &, & one of the concerns of the city has been the use of E.D. & the idea here is for the devr uh to try & go fwd with the process af- without the use of E.D. & get as far into the process as they can & see if there's a possibility to package it - uh, uh some prop together to undertake a redev project.
12/6/05 KMOX - Sec 4 of 7
CB: Now we have uh Dan Miller with us. He's the owner of REAR GEARS on StL Ave in VP. Dan, are u on KMOX? DMiller: Good morning, yes. CB: Good, good morning, uh are, are u gonna sell your prop? DMiller: Well, I would choose not to. If they made me the proper offer, uh I guess would, would have to go along with it. Uh I'm not here to stop E.D. or to stop uh redev. Actually I think E.D. is uh, a misused item in this particular case because uh, uh E.D. was for the good of the entire cmty, not the good of uh a few & uh in this case, uh, uh a devr will make a lot of money off of the prop re- being re-(exist?) if they had - choose to & avoid the use of E.D.
CB: I, I, I think that's the big ques. If for example, City VP enters into an agreemt with a private org, Sansone Group, a devr, to REDEV some area, what happens IF some of the landowners who own the prop don't want to budge or prefer not to - I mean at, at this point, should uh E.D. be used in a yr or 2 yrs if guys like Glenn & uh Dan don't wanna move?
Uh GB of course is the uh consultant working with VP & uh trying to determine a, uh quote/unquote BETTER USE for that area. But then the ques is who can determine what a better use IS? Maybe a food pantry in the eyes of some is the BEST use there. Maybe Rear Gears on StL Ave in VP is the best use for that. How, how would the city or a devr know better when u think about it? We'll take some of your phone calls here at 436-7900 (&/or) 800-925-1120. We're talking about E.D., THIS time in VP. (ads, etc)
12/6/05 KMOX - Sec 5 of 7
CB: Hey, tks for joing us! We're talking about VP. Uh there is a proposal that was approved by the BOA last night, a Preliminary Agreemt between the city & Sansone to dev an area of that city uh for some uses that haven't been specified YET. But obviously, the intent on the part of the city is to generate more tax revenue. How much tax revenue is generated by a food pantry? ZERO! GK is with the Circle of Concern Food Pantry in VP; he is with us. The consultant to the city on this matter is GB; he's with us. We heard from Dan Miller who owns Rear Gears on StL Ave in VP.
& Jim Trout is a BROKER who is rep'g uh some of the other biz owners in that area. Mr Trout, welcome to KMOX, how are u? JTrout: Good morning, I'm fine. CB: Good! JTrout: Tks for having me on. CB: Good, so uh, uh the owners that u rep, are, are they thinking about selling out? JTrout: They want - they, they - nobody likes to have their life turned upside down, but yes, some of them are willing to talk & to negotiate but they know that 1st of all, they have to have an EQUAL standing at the negotiating table. CB: &, & did u think that if u POOL owners together, they'd have a little greater leverage?
JTrout: The point is this - uno at this point there are no bad guys. The city needs money, the devr needs to build something; the homeowners are the ones who weren't invited to the party. _ - CB: Yeah, but at, at the same time, if u have a piece of prop & u don't wanna sell but there's a target on your prop, that's very threatening!
JTrout: I can't imagine - I've been thru a buy-out so I know how threatening it is. I was in one that took 7 YRS & it's still not over. CB: Where, where is that now? JTrout: Rock Hill. CB: Rock Hill, uh at Manchester & McKnight? JTrout: Yes. CB: Uh-huh, yeah that is still going on. JTrout: & there ARE examples like that, uh Sunset Hills gave devrs a black eye & gave uh the city's & their consultants a black eye. On the flip side is Richmond Heights. I've been - was reading last night & I believe PGAV had a rep there. They're going out of their way to, to make sure prop owners are very much involved in the process & that there is a great deal of time &, & daylight on the issues.
CB: Doesn't uh the very SPECTOR of redev & the possibility of E.D. hurt a neighborhood because people stop spending as much money fixing up their props; people are less willing to relocate there & so as a result, the value of the props don't appreciate like they otherwise would? JTrout: The day an RFP goes out, a neighborhood starts dropping in value in my opinion. CB: Because if there's the POSSIBILITY of E.D., homeowners & future homeowners & future prop owners know that they're leverage is DECREASED at that very moment? JTrout: & everybody's counting on that because THEIR job is to get bricks & dirt at the lowest possible price.
12/6/05 KMOX - Sec 6 of 7
CB: We have uh more phone calls here. Let's get to some of those right now including this one from Donna in VP. Good morning, Donna, u're on KMOX. Donna: Good morning. CB: Good morning. Donna: Um they're sayin' that they're offering contracts, that Sansone's offering contracts; Sansone is also - also sending out threatening letters - this is your 3rd & final offer! Then when u call Sansone, _ - CB: Oh, hang on, hang, hang in a moment. U're saying Sansone has sent out FINAL offers!? Donna: Yeah, 3rd & final offers. CB: & GB, u're saying it's too EARLY to start talking about particular props?!
GB: Well, uh _ - CB: HELLOOO! GB: U have - CB: Hello, GB. GB: Well, no, I didn't say - I didn't say that. What I said was that uh to talk about specific, individual props & the use of E.D. or exactly what's going to happen with specific pro- props, it's a little too early to discuss that. CB: I don't think so if these - GB: What - CB: homeowners are getting 3rd & final - GB: What - CB: offers - GB: What - CB: from Sansone.
GB: What happened was - u have to look at where we're at in the process & what happened last night. Up until this point, the Sansone Group has not have any formal uh relationship with the city. Uh they submitted the only uh proposal - when the city sent out their Request For Proposals, the Sansone Group was the only entity to submit. We had calls from numerous other entities that were int'd, but Sansone was the only one who ended up submitting. Last night's action by uh the city named Sansone as the develop- the preferred devr which means they're the devr that uh, uh the city has chosen to come in & begin to try & put the project together.
He says - the gentleman mentioned Sunset Hills & some other projects where uh things have gone wrong. When u're dealing with an area-wide redev like this where u have 100's & 100's of props all under different ownership, all with different interests, it's uh very time-consuming & it can be somewhat uh, uh, uh - it, it, it can be somewhat uh, uh confusing if u have multiple people going in there & offering people contracts, or options I believe is what they're, they're offering individuals. Uh & to try & get the - one of the things u have to do in these projects is get control of things EARLY so u don't have chaos & u have a organized -
CB: Yeah - GB: uh - CB: But, but while - GB: _ - CB: u're - while u're gettin' YOUR ducks in order, so is Sansone, u're suggesting that it's too early to start talkin' about particular props & - GB: No, not for individual - not for individual prop owners. By all means, if the groups of prop owners wanna get together &, & pool their prop & go as a block to uh, uh, uh, uh Sansone &, &, &, & negotiate, that's fine too.
CB: But here's, here's what - here's, here's what gets me &, & this is uh - this, this is what gets to the core of the issue. A guy owns prop, he's havin' a good time, he's enjoying the American life, he's makin' a livin' or he's helpin' the poor & he just wants to stay there. Meanwhile, someone else has eyes on his prop, wants to take it - that's the city with all its might - & they don't EVEN HAVE AN IDEA of what they're gonna put there! GB: Well - CB: I asked u earlier what, what - GB: Well - CB: what's gonna go there. U don't even know!
GB: Well, I think if every - any - if anyone wants to come to the P&Z Cmsn this Tuesday at 7:00, uh we'll be discussing that issue, the issue of what is the plan & getting some more refined lines on the map. Now keep in mind, this is a process. These things take several yrs to put together. When u're talking about a major redev within a COE-funded levee, protecting 400 acres, u're talking about a large area that has a lot of planning issues that need to be resolved & we're at the very beginning stage of ONE of those issues. & all of these ques's, in due-time, we hopefully will get - we WILL get them answered & things will be more clear & it's a step-by-step process & it's one that uh takes a lotta time.
CB: Ok - GB: Now he mentioned - CB: now we - GB: mentioned M - he mentioned E.D. & I just wanted to point out - one of the things we don't know is, that out - after Kelo, what the conditions - E.D. - we'll be able to use for because the LEGr is considering changes to the uh the use of E.D. in MO as we speak. & that -
12/6/05 KMOX - Sec 7 of 7
CB: Ok, let's go to Fred in Union. Good morning, Fred, u're on KMOX. Fred: Yes, uh I mean I think the gentleman reps - more or less rep'g the City of VP is al- is AVOIDING EVERY meaningful ques he CAN relative to the use of E.D.! I just sit out here & we're scared to DEATH of this stuff. Uh (chuckle) & that's my cmt! CB: Tku very much. Well, GB, u can understand how homeowners & prop owners WOULD be very concerned about this.
GB: Well, right, &, & the thing & the thing with - everyone in every muni - & since we have over 90 of 'em in StLCnty, that, that's 90 mtgs - muni's should just talk amongst themselves &, & if they choose, to develop standards of HOW they want E.D. to be used & how to - uh when it will be used or how or - & all of that, should get them - because that's what the State LEGr is doing.
CB: Well, that, that's exactly right & uh there's going to be a gove- gubernatorial cmsn which will release it's results uh & rcmds at the end of the month. Tku very much, GB, VP Planning Consultant, with us this morning on the Voice of StL, KMOX.