Notes:   Last mtg was 10/17/05;  all mtgs are supposed to start at 5pm.  After various chatting, including CLM with MW re the holidays, this "mtg" started at 5:15, had no quorum & lasted until 6:15.  Instead of contributing during & to the mtg, Interim Mayor JW, Ald JKB & in part DS, continually carried on their own discussion at their end of the table, which makes it extremely difficult to transcribe the tape & inform the public.  Around 6pm & within mins after placing my spare recorder near them, DS got up & left, I stood up to see & check on that recorder, noticed & removed some papers that had been placed over it & then observed Lt Melies tapping something on the table right next to it. 


Immediately after the recorder was turned off & other members had left, CLM talked to EM about a VP Levee District, EM being the atty & that he, CLM, would be glad to be a consultant.  >  Before reading TW's cmts in this tscript, answer this for yourself:  Does a big hill of dirt look steeper when u're looking UP at it or DOWN at it?  >  Reminder:  Italics indicates barely audible speech which is often not heard by the audience or even by other cmsn members. 


Present:   JKB,  Interim Mayor JW,  DS,  JZ,  DC,  CLM,  TW,  EM.   


Audience:   Vivian Blackman, VP resident & biz owner & Christopher Wheeler, COE Civil Eng.  Seated at the table was Lt Melies.  

11/21/05 LEV - Sec  1 of  24


DC... mtg under way;  alright, call the mtg to order.  Roll call here (see above). CLM:  Did u see -  JW:  Hey Dave, I guess a ques for Eric - I guess I'm gonna have to appoint somebody to, to my position now 'cause I was an aldermanic 3rd Ward Rep for this cmte, but now - DC:  Maybe none of u know this, but Mr Whitteaker now is, is the mayor.  So he is moved down & he doesn't get to vote any more.  So we need a 3rd Ward - CLM:  Is that true?  DC:  rep.  JW:  Lost ALL my voting powers.  DC:  So I guess uno - CLM:  But long-live the mayor _ himself.  JW: (chuckle)  I think Lee -


DC:  Well, we don't have enough for a mtg but let's have the Pledge of Allegiance here. (As usual & at BOA mtgs, all Pledge except me wearing my 2-sided "Flag Flier" - Ref Photos & Maps Page.)  Does anybody wanna add anything to the discussion items for this mtg? 


JZ:  Yeah, I got a couple of things - DC:  Ok.  JZ:  & Eric, I thought we'd talk about the submittals to uh FEMA - EM:  Sure.  


JZ:  as an Item - DC:  (B or D?).  JZ:  & then we've got another thing about the - re uh #F would be protection of the flood wall at MerVPlz, just for - just a discussion.  & then one more item is uh coordn with EPA re Operable Unit 2.  DC:  Ok, I got part of that on my uh Punch List.  I sent u the - JZ:  Yeah.  DC:  u & Dennis Stephens this I think, ok.  JZ:  Yeah.  DC:  Uh we'll have a discussion - well, I could have a uh motion now to uh, uh close the mtg, bein' we don't even have one but we'll just go on here. 


11/21/05 LEV - Sec  2 of  24


Uh discussion items for the mtg, Item 4B Update - Do u wanna add anything to that, JZ?  JZ:  Yeah, I wanna talk about the money part of it.  DC:  Ok, well how about that down here, the fed sponsor funding, when we get down to C or would u rather talk about it now?  CLM:  It goes together with the _ - JZ:  Yeah, I think - do people know pretty much from your uh your report where we stand on the const mark uno the - DC:  Right! 


JZ:  ESI's just working on the last few items for the Punch List, the list of things that they have to uh wrap up & problems they have to solve.  I really didn't have anything to discuss about that but I wanted to talk about it.  DC:  Ok, I'm going to - I had a Punch List prepared previous before ESI left.  They're GONE!  They're finished;  they - their equipmt is there;  they're gone;  their trailer is gone;  they're pullin' the trailers out, so they're done. 


& this is a PUNCH LIST that I put together.  U'll notice - I'll give u one of these, one of these;  u can look at it - I've taken a lot of things off (&/or lined out evidently) because JM & I took a ride on the levee today & uh this was uh - some of these things were done.  (I reached to be handed a copy)  I'll see if I got copies here;  I don't really know if I got enough copies for everybody _ _.  I gave Jeff one this morning but u probably need another one that's updated.   JW:  I can get mine.  Oh, u got an update - this is scribbled off, yeah.  MM:  (DC gave me a copy) Tku.  DS:  One more, Dave.  DC:  Uh I'll kinda go thru here quickly & kinda get the uh jist of some of the things that's here.


11/21/05 LEV - Sec  3 of  24


Uh we talked about this before & it's the uh steel pipes uh with concrete bollards.  We need to put something up by the uh, uh Fishpot structure, the junction box at 1A on 141, between 141 & MerStaRd.   & it kinda explains in there what it is, that somebody could jump that curb.  That, that is something that we discussed & they were gonna look into it, but I -


JZ:  Well, let me, lemme just point out that that was not in the contract.  So they kind of made a list of things that weren't in the contract & - DC:  Right, right.  JZ:  then there are things that ARE in the contract that had to be resolved.  So this was - DC:  This is something that - JZ:  not, not a contract item but - DC: Right.  JZ:  something that would be extra to the contract.  DC:  Right.


Uh & the rest of those things that I marked off there, we checked 'em out today & that is they're quit, took care of them.  They didn't - I gave this almost all this list to Jim Solari but he never - they never called or anything & let me know they were leaving or anything. 


11/21/05 LEV - Sec  4 of  24


So I guess then the Punch List for Fishpot, uh there's still a lot of erosion on the whole levee.  & uh something about the drainage off of that pkg lot up there, uh the city went & put a drain, a big grated inlet at the northess {sic} corner of that thing there & it doesn't seem like the water's goin' towards it.  I thought they were possibly going to slope it back to that drain that they put in there or to that grated outlet because boy, it's really washin' out.  So we're keepin' an eye on it & I think we're gonna uno in the Spring, have to have them do something (JZ? like coughs) before we've got (some work?).


CLM:  Jim, ah, (has your or as you're?) Project Mgr had any discussions with regard to knowing about what their plans are to come back in & tidy up - JZ:  Well - CLM:  _ - JZ:  uno I, I don't have a specific answer.  I DO think they're still - even tho they might not be here uno on-site, they're still working on certain items & they're not finished yet, so


DC:  Uh we talked about this as another extra thing that this gravel road on the crown of the levee, we need to extend it from the emerg road back to the I-44 {sic} gatewell so the emerg equipmt vehicle has access to the gatewell operator because if it's rainin' & we have to go up & op that gate, we're gonna have our piece of the -  truck & that stuck because there's no way to get back to it;  it's uno at least 50 to 60' maybe back to that or maybe further.  That contractor said they were gonna do it but it, it, it'd never get done & maybe they'll come back & do it this Spring;  I don't know. 


The telephone & cable lines need to be raised.  Uh again, repair of roads erosion uh along the thing.  This - that Det Area A up there is uh - we need to look at that - have maybe Conroy or somebody come out & either Dennis Stephens again to come out & look at.  They did this but I, I really have - I got some ques's about what, what, what they did & how they did it.  It's really - it don't look too good up there. 


CLM:  Which part of it?  DC:  Huh?  CLM:  Jim, Which part of _ _ _ - DC:  That's Det Area A, that's the AL.  CLM:  But I mean which, which one of these are u most concerned with?  DC:  I think ALL of 'em because I mean it's - they went in there, put the silt fences up but I mean back here u'll see that we need to repair all those silt fences & everything else.  They collapsed & water's goin' over 'em & mud & everything.  CLM:  Then they'll have to continue when Spring comes. 


11/21/05 LEV - Sec  5 of  24


DC:  Uh let's see, uh Item 1 here, Jim brought that up - pkg on the gravel area between flood wall & blacktop.  JZ:  Let me have an extra cop- copy to bring to our const people.  DC:  U wanna give one of these - I thought maybe Stephens will want - somebody'll want this - uh to install to prevent damage to the flood wall, use for pkg & storage vehicles uh up there. 


Uh I was there this morning.  I don't see anything different that's goin' on.  They're still pkg vehicles up there & everything so uh Leona (Loana) was to place uh invert at the SA1 & B.  I know Pat Conroy knows about these 2 items here uh but it doesn't seem to me that they were done, completed. 


This is Det Area B.  Uh they talked about a storm water pipe, erosion.  We, we & we're investigatin' the storm water drain each side of the 3rd St uh & advised the COE, something has to be done because it's, it doesn't drain.  & uh (pause) -


MM:  Which one's B?  DC:  This is Det Area B.  MM:  Which is what?  DC:  Huh?  MM:  Which is what _ - DC:  That's on the other side of the RR tracks there on the east side of uh the BN tracks & the storm water pipe & that.  I think they all - when Pat Conroy or somebody sees this, they'll know what we're talkin' about uh 3rd St, the erosion wash-out, there's so much uh erosion that water - uno erosion on that. 


11/21/05 LEV - Sec  6 of  24


On the 5th St - Jim touched on this - to investigate this EPA _ (seven?) on that - the MDNR.  They're going to put some kind of a - uh something up there at - not similar - or something to take care of this uh water that was the TCE's that are like that under uh Ray's Tree Svc & at the 5th St, 5th & where the old uh - where the old - I didn't put that name - I didn't put that name down - I _ - JZ:  It's ok, I need to read this.  DC: Uno where - EMorJZ?:  _ we _ -


DC:  UNO where we're talkin' about.  EM:  It's Precision Forgings.  DC:  Yeah Precision Forgings & it's something Technologies or something - EM:  Valley Technologies, yeah.  DC:  That uh they sold the property & they gotta do something else & they're gonna put the, they're gonna put the runoff of this thing into the 5th St sewer & uh it wasn't figured in on the capacity for the thing. 


11/21/05 LEV - Sec  7 of  24


Uh Det Area C is erosion & they're supposed - this is a mod - it's already been approved that ESI had but there's - wasn't enough money to work on it, whatever - uh addition to a storm water drain down uh in around where the Simpson uh Gravel Plant is. 


Uh I was down there today & I think, I think maybe somebody - uh if u get a chance, TW, send somebody out there & look - Simpson's - looks like he's gonna pave or do something down there & he's right - I don't know - I don't know where the line is or anything else because it looks to me like he's gettin' a way over on, on our prop again.  Supposedly where the line is, what u look for Rideout & where all those down there, uh Kirchner & that, he's way beyond that.


TW:  There should be stakes - well, there WAS stakes down there but we also put some iron rods down in that area so - DC:  Well, it looks like he's went in there & dumped some kind of uh rock or something & got it all bladed off & compacted down like he's gonna pour something back there - I don't know.  & where those big uh blocks & everything in back of the concrete plant next to him, well, he's uno I'd say he's maybe 50 or 60' the other side of them!  I mean he's got a - he's got a pkg lot down there! 


TW:  What should we do about it?  DC:  I'm gonna bring it up to the BOA tonight & see if they wanna have u go down there & survey it again & find out!  I mean I don't know - I don't think -


TW:  Well, I hate to - hate to do that because we've already done that ABOUT 2 different times.  DC:  I know we have.  EM:  We should just go - be able to go down & reestablish the iron posts, couldn't we?  TW:  Well, the iron pipes, if they haven't been disturbed, should BE there.  EM?: _ - TW:  They might be buried, but for sure, but I guess we could look at it & see what we can determine from that (riverside?), instead of sending a survey crew out there again.  EM:  _ _ _ -


DC:  Because I mean uno if - uno we're, we're (kind of?) work with him in order to uh drain an area down there but if that's the case, if he's gonna be messin' around with this, we'll just - we'll just forget about this mod & puttin' this drain for him.  We'll let him have a lake down there.  Let him - let him drain it himself then!


EM:  Well, u, u don't have to bring it up to the Bd.  We'll just go ahead &, & TW will go down in there, see if he can reestablish the iron posts.  DC:  Ok.  See if u can & uno get back with me or something & we'll go down there.


11/21/05 LEV - Sec  8 of  24


Uh next one is the uh - this is Item B uh 4B, Miscellaneous - uh we're in the process of cleanin' River Dr.  We haven't got it done yet;  uh we will do it.  The contractor was gonna do it  but the silt fences, when it rains, go down & the water goes across it & we're gonna try to get it cleaned off & repair it. 


Uh we're gonna permanently block River Dr on the east side of the Ramp Road B;  that's where it comes down & hooks & goes on to River Dr so the emerg vehicle can go underneath the RR bridge.  Uh we're gonna clean - they're workin' on it;  they're doin' it now.  Their piece of equipmt, it broke down & they're gonna be workin' on it, clean & repair River Dr from Kena Ave to the west entrance of the boat ramp pkg lot. 


Uh we've already installed the, the one gate & uh the gate that we - JW: _ _ - DC:  didn't need, we installed it onto the uh west side of the - JW: _ _ - DC:  uh boat ramp & - JW: _ _ - DC:  it's locked;  u can't go any further than the boat ramp - JW: _ _ - DC:  uh 2nd entrance on the uh west end of it there.  So uh - JKB: _ _ - DC:  erosion on the river & land-side of the levee - JW: _ - DC: need to be repaired.  I mean it's very obvious that - JW: _ _ - DC:  we - when u start to cut it - I mean there's - u're gonna have problems with it.  JW?:  (That's why he has 'em tellin' me?) -


11/21/05 LEV - Sec  9 of  24


DC:  & this natural gas line over the levee at Pharoah 'n Avenue needs - I don't know whether - JW: _ _ _ _ - DC:   the COE supervised this inspection or anything else - CLM?: _ _ _ - DC:  but we put a great big hump on down at Marshall Ave in the levee for them to go over that levee & they're workin' on that now.  But that gas line - they didn't put - they didn't put much of a hump in that levee.  I mean it's -


TW:  Are u talkin' about the gas line or the water line?  DC:  Gas line!  TW:  Cause right there is also a future water line that they put along in there.  DC:  Well, this is on - JKB:  That's, that's gonna go pretty soon the way I gather it.  DC:  Over Marshall - over at Pharoah or over Marshall Rd?  JKB:  Marshall Rd.  DC:  Well, this is on Pharoah!  This is where they put that big 10" line up over the levee that goes underneath the river & THEY dug into the levee! 


& we - uno at Marshall down there, we've got a great big hump.  We've added - they added DIRT on top of that levee because when u go down there - u're drivin' here, u gotta go up over the - up over this hump & I, I uno I, I GUESS maybe it's alright.  Maybe it's been compacted & everything right but there's no hump.  U go down there & there's a little bump but nothin' like it's over on Marshall Rd.  & I'm not too sure uno that they - JW?: _ _  - DC:  they compact it to meet all the requiremts in the spec.  I mean they, they dug down - JKB: _ _ _ - DC:  into the levee.  I mean THEY DUG DOWN! 


EM:  That Pharoah line's a HUGE line that went thru - JKB?: _ _ - EM:  it was like _ - DC:  That's a HUGE - that's a 10" gas line that goes thru there!  & they're still workin' on the one end of it on the land-side of it.  It's done on the river-side but it's, it's uno - I, I don't know what - JKB?:  Isn't gonna make no difference. 


DC:  Maybe u have drawings or somebody got something from the COE that - maybe Conroy has - CLM:  It's (only or always?) something that - something that the COE (oughta know about?).  JZ:  Yeah, we ought to - we will.  I'll make a note of it.  CLM?: _ _ -


11/21/05 LEV - Sec  10 of  24


DC:  Uh the silt - JW: _ _ _ - DC:  fences - need to repair it - JW: _ _ - DC: on the river & land-sides of the levee.  All, all the - we - this morning they were down - JW?: _ _ - ?: _ - DC:  um uno maybe get a hold of Conroy;  maybe we could set up - & have some kind of a little look-see at this thing & - JW: _ _ - DC:  everything because they - JW: _ _ - DC:  all the uh drain lines again uh - JW?: _ _ - DC:  they got silt fence around 'em.  I know they do that but it looks like uno this uh - CLM:  Jim _ - DC:  it won't drain!  I mean - CLM:  Jim _ - DC:  they got the silt - all the - they got all the inlet things on the river - on the land-side of the levee uh blocked off with this - got fence around it, got the SILT fence all around it. 


CLM:  Jim _ - DC:  Then they got plastic over the relief wells!  They got plastic wrapped around - JZ:  I don't - DC:  the relief wells!  JZ:  I don't think they're finished yet.  I mean - DC:  Well, I mean uno it's uh uno I - & the, the uh it's siltin' in!  I mean a lotta places at the det pond are not drainin' but I mean it's things that uno I think we maybe oughta take a look at & get some idea what's goin' on.


CLM:  I think what u need to do is Jim needs to find out whether the contract has the requiremt for the contractor to maintain the silt fences;  for example, for any period of time after he completes work on (some of it?) - JZ:  Right - CLM:  normally I don't think that's required. 


JZ:  Well, but I think he's - once they're uh no longer needed, uno they should be removed _ put up silt - CLM:  Yeah, that's - JZ:  (fencing?).  CLM:  that's right.  TW:  Jim - JZ:  Now they may not have removed 'em because maybe he's waiting for the Spring uno - I don't know!  TW:  Right.  JZ:  Maybe he's waiting for Spring where he can finish up his (pause) - TW: _ - DC:  _ _ -  JZ:  his (gas or cast?). 


DC:  I didn't - we didn't get to talk!  Like I say, he never called me so we could talk of these & I don't know if uh uno the contr- uno uh the const uh there - Mike - Mike (Feldmann?) - JZ?: _ - DC:  might - would talk & Vick - CLM:  He, he must have talked to the (manager or major?).  DC:  I hope so!  CLM:  Major - JZ?:  _ should -  CLM:  (Hearns or Ahrens?) _ - JZ:  I mean they're - they're communicating with each other.  Vick James just got back from - DC:  Yeah, he was  - JZ?:  (He was sick?) - DC:  back & uno, ok. 


TW:  But, Jim, on that, before we move off of that uh investigation of the gas line issue - JZ:  Uh-huh.  TW: in association with that, the future proposed water line that I guess was approved by the COE, comin' OVER the levee - JZ:  Yeah.  TW:  where u had paid or allowed the water coming in & paying ESI to put in the hump - 'cause somebody at the COE - JZ:  Uh-huh.  TW:  (ruined or ruled on?) that - ?:  (Ok?).  TW:  it'd be nice to know who did approve that,  #1. 


#2, it LOOKS LIKE - hard to say - but the grades look fairly steep on that road.  It was split - JZ:  Uh-huh.  TW:  in half.  I'd like someone from the COE to verify that that road has an acceptable grade to satisfy your own requiremts 'cause when Pat & I looked at it, we both kind of looked at it like, hmm, that road looks a little steep.  ?: _ _ _ - TW:  & if it IS too steep, then the water co needs to pay ESI or WHOEVER to make sure it's at the right grade. 


JZ:  Yeah, there should've been a plan uno that was approved by the COE & - TW:  Right.  JW:  they should've built it according to the plan.  TW:  Right & if they DIDN'T build it - if they DID, FINE & then it could - & it COULD be an optical illusion 'cause any time u're looking UP at a grade like that, it does appear to be steeper;  so that uno that's very possible, but - JZ:  Uh-huh.  TW:  it does look fairly steep & even Pat cmt'd on it _ _ - CLMorEM?:  We're switching _ - TW:  _ & lookin' at it - JZ:  Ok, so I'll check into that too _ - TW:  'cause if it - it needs to be flattened out, then it has to be flattened out.  JZ:  Uh-huh.


TW:  By the way, the CITY hasn't approved that water line goin' across the road yet, just so u guys know that.  JZ:  Ok.  TW:  Because of a lotta reasons - EM?:  (That was good?).  TW:  but that's not a DONE deal YET.  JZ:  Uh-huh, ok.  EM:  It's already _ _ _ _ - DC:  Then - ?:  Good for (Eric or Rick?).


11/21/05 LEV - Sec  11 of  24


DC:  the next  couple pages here are - this are items that are - JKB:  Got my _ - DC:  still pending on the whole, whole uh levee structures.  At the StL Ave closure structure - ?: _ - DC:  the sill plate across StL Ave is loose & uh Eng Duane Ackley, he's a structural eng & has worked up a plan to repair this problem;  & uh the COE is responsible for repair.  Uh I don't know when, when we're gonna do this. 


We had - we inspected the gates, the closure structures, uh on the - in November the 2nd one day & uh the gates went down & sealed uh what, what we can conclude there, uh very good.  It looks like they'd seal & everything but uh I don't think this uh - this StL Ave is gettin' bad 'cause when the trucks go over this..(exchange tapes)


...DC:...So uh it's uh - TW:  Does that - DC:  We're just gonna - TW:  involve some type of grout?  DC:  Well, he's going to - TW:  Did u have to - DC:  they're gonna do - TW: (ease into it?)?  DC:  They're gonna - he's gonna try to uh, uh do that with some kind of grout.  He's gonna try to - TW:  the (Dodge Graham?) grout - DC: _ - TW:  cause u can inject it. 


DC:  There's an I-beam in there & he's going to investigate to see whether he can take & drill some holes into that I-beam thru that plate & then - TW:  Raise it - DC:  bring it back down or whatever it is - TW:  Right - DC:  & put some screws & some flat screws or somethin' - bolts - & then get in there & then grout it underneath the whole thing & so he can get it up. 


But he's - JW?: _ _ - DC: he's got a plan for it & he - but he's just - JW: _ _ - DC:  like he said they just don't have the money - JW?:  (Better stop?) - DC:  aprop'd to - TW:  Can - DC:  do this _.  TW:  can we also get a copy of that plan before we start doin' it - DC:  I have a - TW:  because - DC:  I have a copy of the thing but I'll give - TW:  because it involves the roadway &, & again, just to like to have - ?: _ - TW:  the city's opportunity to just take a quick look at that & see if that's what we think might work. 


DC:  Ok, I got - TW:  U won't wanna have to - JW: _ _ - TW:  keep goin' back in & clearin' this - DC:  I'll pick up when - TW: thing in the future.  DC:  Are u gonna be at the mtg tonight?  JW: _ _ - TW:  Yes.  DC:  I'll bring it.  I got a drawing that - JKB?: _  - TW:  If there was - DC:  submitted - ?: _ _ - TW:  maybe a possible record. 


?: _ _ - ?: _ _ - TW:  I mean we've got a lot of experience with roadwork so maybe _ _ - JZ:  Yeah, sure!  TW:  _ _ be possible _ _ - JKB: _ - JZ:  So are u gonna - ?: _ - JZ:  provide that to Tom, then?  DC:   Yeah, I'll get - JKB: _ _ - DC:  I'll get him a copy of that, yeah.  JKB: _ _ - DC:  I'll get him a copy. 


11/21/05 LEV - Sec  12 of  24


Uh the next one is a punch list item for Grand Glaize Creek - uh - JW:  I'm wonderin'  - DC:  we've been havin' a problem with the - losin' fill & that on the wash-out & we inspected it uh - Pat came out & we went down in & he went down in there & looked around & he suggested just what I said to test the pipe.  We went over & dumped water on the ground slowly & let it go in & the fellas got down in there.  ?: _ -


& uh, uh they're -  we're obtaining a cost est to make the repairs &/but if the city - it's - JKB: _ _ - DC:  it's gonna be an expensive repair because we got joints - JKB: _ - DC:  that's leakin';  we got manhole - uh the inlet structures for the things they put in there are leakin' around the edges, mud goin' in it & the pipe - uno we got big HOLES alongside the pipe & into the inlet structure to do it.  JW: _ _ - DC:  This is going to be uh - JW: _  -


DC:  uh the city is tryin' to change the process but I think uh Tom may be workin' on this too.  But uh if we do this repair, I think that uno we should get some kind of credit uh on this thing if we do this work.  I mean I don't know whether we can work this out or HOW we're gonna work it out - JW: _  - DC: but if this is gonna be something that - JW: _  - DC:  we're gonna have to dig pipe up & see if they're sealed & everything else & we're gonna have to get some equipmt to do it _ _ so this is something that we gotta talk -


JZ:  Yeah, talk it over - DC:  talked about it before - JZ:  talk about it with me because we uno like we may have enough money to work on it this yr & we may uno may be able to decide how to handle it.  DC:  Ok.  JZ:  I mean maybe we can handle it thru a regular - a different contract or whatever.  DC:  Ok.


11/21/05 LEV - Sec  13 of  24


Uh & there's some grading on the junction box;  I showed this to Pat & he looked at it & the thing of it is, when they put the grading in, they didn't put any beams across it & if it's a flood - it's a fiberglass & it's just - it goes DOWN uno & there at Leonard Pk.  We didn't know them kids get on that thing & start boucin' around on that fiberglass, 4 or 5 of the kids & they'll bust it in.  So we went down there & we put some uh steel plates over the grading uh in - but to it, but I think maybe it needs to have a uh maybe it needs to be metal grating over that thing in order to keep it from uh goin' down, & uh but we talked about it & it's another thing we'll have to bring up uno when we take a look at all these things. 


Uh I know - ?: _ - DC:  that we came up with this dike between - ?: _ - DC:  the north side of the creek channel & the south side of the - ?: _ _ - DC:  wetland pool down there - JKB: _ - DC:  at GG.  It's continued to over rate {sic} They - ?: _ - DC:  they tried to do something with it  - ?: _ - DC:  & I don't know whether they have been takin' pictures of it or checkin' it any more, but man, I mean to tell u - JW: _ - DC:  one end of it uh - JW: _ - DC:  is just - it's goin'!  I mean it, it - they planted trees & everything.  The one part of it looks pretty good but the rest of it is - & maybe, maybe they don't really care if it washes out but I'd like to have - I think Tim George & somebody else was comin' out here & keeping track of that. 


They had some kind of a deal that they do it & I mean uh I'd like for maybe them to get a hold of me or one of us;  go down there & maybe take a look at it & see.  JW: _ - DC:  If it's uno if that washes out, is that gonna cause any damage to the - ?: _ _ - DC:  creek-side of the levee or uh uno when they get the creek channel changes or anything like that?  JZ:  Yeah.  DC:  I'd like to just -


JZ:  Yeah, I mean we're aware of it.  We - DC:  I know.  We talked - JZ: _ _ - DC:  about it - ?:  _ -  DC:  when we did was down there that day & the same thing at - we're back at Fishpot - the same thing, the sill plate at Vance Road.  Duane has looked at that  & it's the same plan that he's worked out  for StL Ave thru that. 


& uh - ?: _ - DC:  this thing here, if uh the COE will let us do it, we're gonna make a new gate operator for that stem cover up on the sluice gate up on GG because they keep - JKB: _ - DC:  somebody keeps takin' the thing off & either tearing it up or stealin' it or whatever they do with it I don't know.  But we're gonna make one that - if it's ok with the COE.  Can we do that, Jim?  Without any - I mean we're just gonna -


JZ:  For op & maint?  DC:  Yeah, it was a - it was just a uh plastic pipe that they put on it in the very beginning that went over the top of it & - JZ:  Yeah, I know what u're talkin' about.  DC:  it's just to keep it from uh - we're gonna make it - fix it so we can secure it down to uh, uh drill some holes in it or somethin' so we can secure it to the base of the operator there so we can keep it from gettin' in the weather & everything - JZ:  Why don't u uno - DC:  because - JZ:  get us - DC:  we'll take it off of there. 


JZ:  Get us the drawings of it.  _ _ _ - DC:  Huh?  JZ:  Give us - JKB?: _ _ - JZ:  some kind of drawing of - JKB?: _ _ - JZ:  what u're gonna do.  DC:  Ok, all we're gonna do is when Conroy comes out here, we'll have him - JKB?: _ _ - DC:  he'll take a look at it.  (Conroy→☺ →)


Ok, gentlemen.  I think these are items that we need to have taken care of before uno we, we get finalization on the levee & so we're, we're gettin' really the product that uh here - none of these items are gonna hurt if we have a flood that we can - everything operates.  The gates operate, everything is uno if we have a flood, bingo, we can put her down.  Uh even with the little glitches that we had up at Vance Rd, let me tell u, those guys -  ?: _ _ - DC:  the emerg mgmt crew, they do it!  I mean it's just uh - & it was - it looked - the trouble we had was with the equipmt was - that we used to close the gate.  The drill broke & uh we've got that fixed now but uh uno the boys put it together. 


We don't have a pigeon problem any more.  Uh the things that we - the screens that now we got on there, the pigeons are not in there.  It was sort of a just a - JKB: _ _ - DC:  really went thru it, we did it.  We figured - JW: (chuckles) _ - DC:  it'd take about 6 to - 4 to 6 hrs & - ?: _ _ - DC:  we were done in about 4 hrs - JKB: _ _ - DC:  that we got done, probably a little less that we, we took a break & whatever, but it really went well.  Ok, that's all I have on 4B - if anybody else - JW?: _ _ - DC:  I mean I, I - JZ:  Yeah, I've got some -


11/21/05 LEV - Sec  14 of  24


DC:  I was very - JKB: _ _ - DC:  I was very surprised that - JKB: _ _ - DC:  the contractor didn't contact us that he was leavin' - JKB:  What an orgy!  DC:  but I understand there was some changes made in - JKB: _ _ - DC: in ownership of ESI & so I guess that uh the - CLM:  It was sold out, bought by somebody - _?  DC:  Well - JZ:  I'll be happy to explain everything if u would let me give - JW:  Now he's gonna _ - JZ:  give me a chance here (chuckle).  DC:  Yeah, he probably - he knows probably more about it - JW: _ _ _ - DC:  than I do.  He can give u the up-to-date on that.  Ok!


JZ:  Uh 1st of all, I wanna introduce Chris Wheeler who's joined us this evening.  Uh he's with the COE;  he's in our geotech ofc & Chris is an army intern & he's uno he's - his salary is paid for by the army rather than by the COE so basically he's workin' for us for free.  & he's helpin' on a lot of projects & uh he wanted to - JW:  Nice guy!  JZ:  for - uno as far as payin' him from the project, yeah, it's free & uh - CLM:  He, he - JZ:  He was  int'd - CLM:  he was really careful to make sure we, we understood that.  JZ:  Yeah.  (JW & CLM start chuckling) CLM:  He said it 3, 3 times now, didn't he!  JZ:  Uhh - CLM:  U're really gonna be the - JZ:  U said it (chuckle) - CLM:  lucky guy that - ?: _ _ -


JZ:  Um anyway, he, he wanted to uh see what it's like to come to mtgs with the sponsors & other groups & so I said yeah!  U're welcome to come this evening.  ?:  I think - DC:  Has he been to - have u been out on the project at all?  Have u toured the project at all?  CWheeler:  Yes, I've seen it a couple times, yeah.  JZ:  He's done some work out there for us.  DC:  Ok.


11/21/05 LEV - Sec  15 of  24


JZ:  Umm as far as the Item 4B Update, the Pres signed the Energy & Water Aprops Act on Saturday & of course the Act includes $7,582K for VP.  Um we - CLM:  Goes up!  That's every penny the COE said they could use. 


JZ:  At this point umm we're going into a 2nd Continuing Resolution Authy (CRA) period that goes from - the 1st CRA period went to 11/18, this one goes to 12/17, so uno we're not gonna get the total allocation until after 12/17.  Um so we're working to try to get a little bit more money during this, this NEW CRA to pay uh, to pay ESI another, another paymt. 


CLM:  U're talkin' about getting money from - counting just '05.  JZ:  No!  No, the CRA is for FY - CLM:  Comin' up 06.  JZ: 06 - CLM:  But u're talkin' about getting MORE money thru the CRA than the - than was in the bill.  JZ:  No!  CLM:  Talkin' about just getting part of that money from - JZ:  The bill has 7,582K - CLM:  I think it's ironic.  JZ:  in it.  We've already - we already had ONE CRA.  I know u weren't at the last mtg but we paid - CLM?:  (Which one?) - JZ:  the contractor $1,089K - CLM:  Out of the 1st CRA.  JZ:  Out of the 1st CRA.  That's money that's fiscal 06 money.  CLM:  So it comes out of the 7582.  JZ:  Right - CLM:  Ok. 


JZ:  & so we - we're expecting to get MORE money NOW & we hope to pay the contractor another paymt, ok, between - CLM:  But u're - JZ:  now & 12/17.  All of that counts toward the fiscal 80 - uh 06 budget - CLM:  Right.  JZ:  If we get the 06 amt uno, we'd like to pay off the contractor obviously;  that's - we owe them a lot of money.


CLM:  & your budget request is based upon what u thought was the total money u needed to pay off the contractor, but it didn't take into acct the Savings & Slippage (S&S) OMB will pull out of the 7M582 - JZ:  True - CLM:  which could be - JZ: uh - CLM:  up to 700 - JZ:  it, it - CLM:  hundred 50 - JZ:  we - CLM:  thousand.


JZ:  Yeah, we uh - we can only ask for as much - we have enough money to finish the project according to our ests & we can only ask for that amt of money.   CLM:  Right.  JZ:  & um the thing that's a little bit unusual as, as I mentioned at the last mtg, at the end of FY 05, there were about $500K reprogrammed into VP Project from other projects - CLM:  Where the problems start.  JZ:  & whether we need to pay that money back still remains to be seen - or all of it or part of it, & whether uh there's gonna be a S&S applied to this FY06 budget, still remains to be seen. 


CLM:  Uno the rules we - some say - JZ:  There's some talk that there WOULDN'T be any - CLM:  Oh really!  JZ:  S&S this yr.  CLM:  That'd be a problem - JZ:  Yeah, just - CLM:  that needs (chuckling) to be changed.  JZ:  because - I don't know -


CLM:  The reason it was so important to get the money programmed in at the end of 05 is because the COE anticipated - we all anticipated that 7,582K, if we GOT it all. that's the most they can ask for as Jim has explained - that OMB usually takes S&S out of that.  So by the time the COE gets the money allocated, it might be 10% or 12% less - JZ:  Right.  CLM:  than what they figured they had to have to pay off the contractor. 


So we were tryin' to get the extra money reprogrammed in from other sources outside the dist & uno 500K, it's - that should go a long ways towards making up for S&S.  & we HAVE discussed this with the congressional delegation, that we may well be needing unconditional funds - JZ:  Uh-huh.  CLM:  at the beginning of the FY to make up the shortfall in the S&S &/or any unexpected uh costs that have gone unseen that might cause the total contract to exceed this amt that the S&S could & would be - JZ:  Yeah.  CLM:  total.  That's, that's basically - it's REALLY good news that they got the money reprogrammed in, the extra 500K for 05.  That, that may or may not have to be paid back. 


& the other good news is that in the House & Senate 'n the Joint Conf ALLOWED EVERY penny that the COE asked for.  THAT is one of the few projects that I've been tracking to keep track of where the COE got everything that they asked for - for the sake of the amt of money (since?) -  JZ:  Right.  CLM:   (they?) cut back the others severely. 


11/21/05 LEV - Sec  16 of  24


JZ:  Um we had a mtg today with Republic Svcs &, & ESI.  This mtg was set up uno a couple wks ago.  It just worked out to be the, the Monday after the Pres signed the Aprops Bill so it worked out pretty nice. 


CLM:  Did they buy any drinks?  JZ:  No.  (CLM chuckles)  No.  Umm they did mention - they did tell us that uhh, that uh Alan Wolfe has purchased all the stock for ESI from Republic Svcs.  ?:  (At home?)!  CLM:  Yeah, Alan!  EM:  NO KIDDING!!  CLM:  Man!  I thought he was _ - DC:  He owned that co in the beginning.  EM:  Oh, I didn't realize that!  CLM:  Yeah, but I thought he'd be bought out - his int would be bought out - EM:  I'll be damn!  CLM:  by Republic.  JZ:  So he, he is - CLM:  That IS interesting!  JZ:  He owns all the stock in ESI as of 10/31. 


So the way that's working is that uh Republic Svcs has only accepted the debt so-to-speak that accrued before 10/31 & any debt that accrues AFTER 10/31 is up to Alan to decide on or what he wants to do or uno what he can afford to do or WHATever!  (chuckle).  Ok, so any, any earnings before 10/31, all the int that goes with that is the responsibility of Republic Svcs;  that's their arrangemt between the 2 of them, those 2 groups.  & they are VERY int'd in being paid & uh they called their cgsm uno down in Texas & he expressed int in it, or at least his staff member did.


& um SO, basically what's gonna happen is um uno we're hoping like I said that, that during this current CRA, umm we'll have SOME money provided to us to pay another paymt to ESI.  ?: _ _ - JZ:  In the 1st CRA again, we JW?: _ _ - JZ:  we paid fed gov't amt of 1M089 & we, the sponsor, we withdrew 114K from the escrow acct  & we paid the contractor with THAT money as well;  ok, that just got paid last wk.  CLM:  (Just?) 114?  JZ:  114 is sponsor money. 


So today I wrote this letter withdrawing the rest of the sponsor's money from the escrow acct & it was just being routed thru, thru the ofc for a sig, but that's where it stands right now but it'll, it'll take out the rest of the uh sponsor's cash contribution for 06.  So that's another 363K & I wanna have that handy if uno to make a paymt to ESI as soon as I can basically to match, kind of match what they're paying, what the fed gov't is paying.  Um -


CLM:  That 363 is all that's left in the escrow acct _ _ - JZ:  Yeah, that's what we asked - we asked for a total of 477 & then the city provided that in the escrow acct.  Um so as far as paying ESI, uno they really wanna be paid & we're gonna pay 'em as soon as we can with, with the 1st paymt & then as soon as they're - it - when the final amt of money comes for the aprop, then we'll - JW:  pay as much as u can - JZ:  pay them off if we can, assuming that we have enough money to pay them off, uno.  CLM:  Now Republic Svcs - JZ:  If we can we will.


CLM:  Republic Svcs is based in Texas.  JZ:  Um that's where this vice pres was from that we met with today.  CLM:  He's the guy who I asked if he contacted America - his cgsm - he said - JZ:  Right.  CLM:  (he really did or it will be done?).  JZ:  Pete Sessions.  CLM:  Sessions, ok.  


JZ:  Yeah.  CLM:  & ESI, now are they still headqtr'd in Kansas City?  JZ:  Yes.  ?:  _ - CLM:  Have they made any contacts with their - ?:  _ - CLM:  congressional team?   JW?: _ - JZ:  I don't know.  JW?:  I think Eric's about to -


CLM:  They - uno they were supposed to call me some time ago after we had them important mtgs to talk about equipmt better be let out - JZ:  Yeah.  CLM:  so Bommarito can bum 'em - ?:  _ _ -


JZ:  BUT IN - EM?:  _ - JZ:  ANY CASE UUM  -  EM:  took out (3?) - JZ:  Congress has acted & the Pres has acted, so I guess things are - CLM:  So go do it!  JZ:  going pretty well, about - EM:  It wasn't - JZ:  as well as they can.  EM:  functioning.


11/21/05 LEV - Sec  17 of  24


JZ:  Um uno as far as all these Punch List items, uno we have to work those uno with, with - DC:  Right!  JZ: with the contractor.  DC:  Right.  JZ:  & - ?:  Sorry.  JZ:  The object _ _.  I think they'll treat us fairly;  they've treated us fairly all along, so I won't be surprised if they don't now.   DC:  Oh, I , I'm, I'm sure that (pause) -


JKB:  They're on butt-saving part of it now.  JZ:  Umm - ?: _ - CLM:  & from the 2nd CRA - ?: _ - CLM:  do u anticipate FEMA's normal position of getting an amt related back - JW:  It won't come up till the storage.  CLM:  (to make them?) finish doing - DS:  (I don't know WHY?) - CLM:  _ _ - DS:  (call colonel?). 


JW:  I'm in (awe?).  JZ:  There, there's a RULE (chuckle) ?:  What do u think of that?   ?:  Gettin' _ _ - JZ:  But the rule's being applied is - ?: _ - JZ:  no project can have - ?:  _ - JZ:  any more money than - JW?:  _ does that mean?   JZ:  what was in the Conf Cmte amt in FY05.  CLM:  That's right!   JZ:  & that rule - that means - DS?:  _ _ - JZ:  VP can't have any more money than 2M uh - JW?:  (Yes they can?).  JZ:  060 which was the Conf amt in 05.  So what we're tryin' to do is have - ?: _ _ - JZ:  have the COE give us that amt of money (chuckle) - JW:  Get us a trade _ _ - JZ:  in total. 


CLM:  So what u're talkin' about is roughly uh - DS:  Took a while.  CLM:  about another - a little under another Million!  JZ:  Yeah.  CLM:  990K - JZ:  Yeah.  CLM:  Probably the 2nd CRA - JZ:  Oh yeah & u don't - we have also spent money on const mgmt & a bunch of other things as well & it just - spent money besides what we paid ESI.  CLM?: _ _ - JZ:  Yeah.  JW:  (Time or tell him?) to answer that one.  


11/21/05 LEV - Sec  18 of  24


JZ:  Uh lemme, lemme go on to the next thing, uno the cost share, Item - if there's - unless there's any ques's about Item 4B.  The uh cost share, sponsor uh - basically, it, it's the same situation um, Eric, uno we, we still have the same est that we provided back to u in uh - EM:  03, whatever _ - oh, oh, oh, the, the March.  JZ:  Yeah.  EM:  Last updated on _ - ?:  Here it is.  JZ:  3/05, uno this - it's the same project cost est.  The city's cost share is, is like 12M523 & most of that's lands & - EM:  Right. 


JZ:  & there's a cash contribution, 2M471 - ?: _ - JZ:  & we had um - when we uh requested the FY06 appropriately,  the cost - cash contribution from uh the city in August, we asked for 2M451.  So there's 20K we haven't asked for yet - JKB: _ _ - JZ: & that was partly due to anticipated - anticipation that it'd be some kinda - JW?: _ _ - JZ:  S&S applied - EM:  Sure. 


JZ:  & we wouldn't be able to close the project out.  Uno what we'd really wanna do, NOW, if we get all this money & there's no S&S applied, we wanna do - we wanna close the project out which is - there'd, there'd be a lotta work to do!  There'll, there'll be uh op & maint manuals that we need to get done, which we really wanna get done.  We, we need to keep coord'g on the FEMA. 


We need to resolve all the lands & relocations issues & uh - CLM:  Boy, u've got a - u've gotta look - JZ:  THERE'S OTHER - CLM: _ _ - JZ:  little things that have come up uno with the - like this Vance Rd.  There's other pieces of work that have come up, small things, that we would like to address & resolve & turn the whole project over to the sponsor. 


CLM:  It really takes a YEAR to wrap up &, & make the project complete. 


JZ:  So - but we've - JW?:  _ - JZ:  never thought we might have - JW?:  _ - JZ:  all the money to do that until now.  Maybe we will now.  So that's - CLM:  Yeah, I thought - JZ:  that's where - CLM: _ - JZ:  we're gonna head if we can get - if we get the money, ok & that's my main point & um - for the cost share now.  Um we'll have to work together on getting that 'cause uno if the r.e. changes, then the total relationship changes as far as cash contributions & all that. 


11/21/05 LEV - Sec  19 of  24


Um we talked about fed & sponsor funding for 2006, that's #C.  Um I've got a couple more uno things to talk about later in the agenda, but do u wanna go on with uh #D there I guess.  DC:  Uh do we wanna discuss this or - the setting up of a Levee Dist tonight or do u wanna wait till uh next month & get -


EM:  Well, just, just from uh a REALITY standpoint, u're NOT gonna be able to get a Levee Dist established & set up unless u have a unity of prop down here or, or a significant consolidation of props simply because it, it takes a vote by either the prop owners or a vote by the, the electorate down here to establish a taxing dist.  & RARELY would u find people voting to tax themselves for something that's already in place uno uuum (pause, que CLM) -


CLM:  Strong leadership by the mayor - EM: (starts laughing) Yeah! - CLM:  they're not gonna all jump up & do that.  EM: (laughing) That'd, that'd take a awful strong leadership!  (some laugh/chuckle) -  JW:  I think I'll uh - CLMorDS?:  Why couldn't (Windy?) do that?  JW:  I think I'll dictate to somebody else to go do that project.  (CLM laughing) 


EM:  I, I, I think the bottom line is if, if this area ever gets redev'd, a condition WOULD BE that - JW: _ _ - EM:  the devr would, when he gets unity of prop, establish a LEVEE Dist & that Levee Dist will then have uh a levy sufficient to, to pay ops & maint & uh, uh - DS?:  (I have in mind?) they're waitin' for (all?) _  - EM:  hopefully have the ability along with the city maybe that - to be a, a local - JKB:  _ _ (elected?) - EM:  sponsor eh, eh - JKB:  all that means is - EM:  enhancemt is - JKB: _ _ - EM:  is uh in the works.  


CLM:  Yeah, ideally the - ?:  This city won't _ - CLM:  my rcmd is as Eric said, that that's the route the cities must see.  JW:  (He just denied?) _ - CLM:  The ideal situation is - JW:  __8K_  - CLM:  u end up like - JW:  a pretty good chunk of change.  CLM:  City of Chesterfield Monarch Chesterfield Levee Project where Monarch Chesterfield (noise of spare recorder placed on table) Levee Dist which in this case, was already in existence, & been for 50, 60 yrs even tho it was an - ?: _ _- CLM:  (agricultural?) 50 yrs, they were - they, they have to go on the BOOKS.  Then they have to go thru this election process. 


Starting out like this, u've GOT to have - basically, the property owners get to vote  based on - JKB?: _ - CLM:  the # of acres they have.  DS:  Yeah.  CLM:  So it's a weight-in - ?: _ - CLM:  weighted vote & they WILL be voting to tax themselves but & generally they WILL benefit from it but people won't admit that or see that up front - till after it's a done deal. 


So the best way to - ?: _ _ - CLM:  from my viewpoint if I were the city, I would wait & I would make it a part of the, the redev package with the REDEVR that THEY take the bull by the horns & spend their money & time & using Eric's expertise to get the LEG passed that says it's a Levee Dist, working with the city hand-in-glove & that THEY be the Levee Dist Operator & on retainer with some sort of oversight condition in there, locked in so the city still has your oversight of the Levee Dist itself.


EM:  Yeah, we probably wanna retain possession of the - JW:  Something like with - EM:  property - JW:  Morris - CLM:  Exactly!  EM:  & have some sort of - DS:  I'll see u later - EM:  mgmt agreemt (because or clause?) - CLM:  Lease property.


DC:  Well, yeah, I mean that would be uno how they're - how we're gonna - how u're gonna op & manage it thru the thing but uh - CLM:  & u - DS:  See u later - CLM:  & u wanna keep - DS:  I gotta get outta - CLM:  the city (woughtna = would want to?) retain control of the legal side of - EM:  Goodnight, Mr. Smith (DS) - CLM:  it too.  EM?:  Yeah.  JW:  The city oughta be (discussing this with?) _ _.


DC:  Well, ok.  CLM:  That way, in this case, the city - DC:  maybe we'll keep talkin' about it at the -  CLM:  the city atty would be taking care of the city's int - in the long run;  that's what he want - what it boils down to.  DC:  Ok.


11/21/05 LEV - Sec  20 of  24


JZ:  Just a couple of things on - DC:  E, F & G.  JZ:  Yeah, su-submittals to FEMA - uno we're trying to work 2 efforts to get um FEMA action that allows the uh flood ins rates to come down.  One is this uh approach under 44CFR6112 & Eric, this is the, the letter that we - that we're working on.  Umm Dennis Stephens added a little bit info about the hydraulics & I made a minor change to it to reflect the fact that we've got an aprop for the rest of the - EM:  Correct(ed?)? - JZ:  funds, ok.  Uum so that's - uno we still have to work together to finish this letter up.  ?: _ -


JZ:  The other, the other route is the standard route for making a submittal for a letter - Letter of Map Revision (LOMR) &, & there was a, a mtg between the city & the COE & StLCnty on 11/4 where we discussed the hydraulics of uh not only this, the VP side of the Mer River, but the StLCnty side & all, all of the uh implications in uninc'd StLCnty.  & at that mtg, there was the chief counsel for the cnty & the chief of planning & the chief of PBW & uno it was uh there


They have a big int in this FEMA submittal, partly because um part of the cnty that's impacted, includes the Hwy 141 bridge & embankmt which has some const evidently in the floodway & it includes the PPk Landfill which the city - the cnty inherited from PPk when PPk uh went out of existence.  So there was a lot of int. 


Um Eric, this is the submittal that Dennis Stephens just gave to uh - it was mailed to cnty - I'm just giving u a copy of it.  EM:  Ok.  JZ:  All, all the hydraulics data & all the maps & everything, I wanted u to have a copy of it.  CLM:  Key's the TIF.


JZ:  Um - EM:  Then we should be real close - ?:  city - EM:  to submittal then.  I, I, I've got all the const data - ?:  I'm sure u do!  EM:  contract - CLM?:  Is this for the cnty?   EM:  award data - JZ:  Uh-huh.  EM:  I'll help - make an addendum on that.  JZ:  Right.  CLM:  _ can oversee us - EM:  Uh, uh, uh how close to u are - CLM:  & they know it.  EM:  in putting this - CLM:  (It won't?) - EM:  on your - CLM:  be this yr.  EM:  letterhead on it? 


JZ:  Uumm - CLM:  Once u get into - JZ:  I wanted to - CLM:  the P&Z - JZ:  talk to u about the - EM?:  (some sort of?) plan & code _ - JZ:  let's see here - CLM:  & give it to the (major or mayor?) - JZ:  piece of info on the uh - CLM:  I'm sure he'll take care of - JZ:  aprops per FY.  CLM:  (should?) have it about a week (before?) - EM:  Ok.  JZ:  uno - CLM:  reason_ - JZ:  whether - what u - CLM?:  _ the ownership - JZ:  what u absolutely need for that.  Um let's see -


EM:  Yeah, now that it's 100% - CLM:  He was censured - EM:  I don't know _ wants it.  CLM?: _ - JZ:  Yeah, I don't know if we need all that - EM:  Yeah - JZ:  all that back-up data.  EM:  The heck with that.  JZ:  Yeah.  ?:  Which account - JZ:  We've got a - we got - ?:  It came outta FEMA - JZ:  a complex table that shows how much - ?: _ - JZ:  the House & Senate aprop'd - ?:  _ sponsor - JZ: & then what was taken out - CLM:  that son of a bitch only has to OATH - JZ:  uno for S&S & how much was reprogrammed in the project & all that stuff - EM:  That's not much (work?) - JZ:  FY01 -


EM:  We'll just do the contract award data - ?:  Salp - EM:  I'll have my sec'y click that & I'll - JZ:  Ok.  EM:  take it home.  JZ:  Um - EM:  Good! 


11/21/05 LEV - Sec  21 of  24


JZ:  OK!  So protection of the flood wall at MerVPlz, that's #F.  ?:  It's not B?  JZ:  Uno Eric sug'd that we prepare - CLM:  _ - JZ:  a letter & describe uno to the city what we, what we wanna have done on that property & I'll just say that we've got the letter drafted up & we've get - we've got uno a, a starting & end point for the flood wall & um some thoughts on how - what guage of (lard?)  (someone coughs) (braid?) & so forth but it hasn't been quite finalized - EM?:  Ok.  JZ:  at this moment in time but we're close to givin' u a letter & we'll talk to u about it before we send it to u.


EM:  Just real briefly, there's a problem with pkg uh ATV's back on the flood wall & the COE's concerned it'll be chipped or damaged & there's uh - there's other problems & it's blockage of the, the access way & inspection point & all that, so - JZ:  He's tryin' to work a, a mutual agreemt between the COE, the city & the owner & that will involve putting up a guard rail uh against them - to protect that flood wall from any vehicles & things. 


EM:  So we'll probably be gettin' calls from the shopping ctr or Maurer's in the Spring (if or after?) they (came or cave?) in & (blighted?) (pause) everybody!  


11/21/05 LEV - Sec  22 of  24


JZ:  UM THE last item I had was this coordn with EPA on Operable Unit 2 & uno I talked with um with the lady's whose name is on the uh public notice - EM:  Right.  JZ:  as well as uh the Eng Steve Aucterlane, Auctelonny & basically they're - he's saying that uh when they put this unit in op, it will pump water into the city sewer system that they will JUST TURN IT OFF !  whenever uno there's gonna be a flood so there's no problem with uh - ?:  Ok.  JZ:  water bldg up in the det area or anything like that.


EM:  Has anybody talked how long this - these op'g systems last?  For instance Wainwright Op'g Unit 1 &, & this - are the 50 yrs, 20 yrs?  JZ:  Um I don't know the duration.  I, I - it may be described in this, this big plan that they've provided.  CLM:  U'd think it's be tied to the levels of the toxins - toxic (chemical?) - EM:  Yeah - CLM:  that (reaches?) - EM:  probably is - CLM:  certain (swarm?).  EM:  with monitoring I guess. 


JZ:  I asked about water quality too;  how it might impact our uno our, our facility & uh he said well, it's gonna be drinking water standard so it should've - (chuckle) it shouldn't impact - EM:  I'm not gonna drink out of it but - JZ:  I'm not either!  (CLM chuckling)  But it shouldn't impact concrete pipes & - CLM:  Oh no.  JW:  Come on, Eric - JZ:  at the gates.  EM:  & u're inside - JW:  take one for the team (he laughs) - DC:  That's what Reichhold claims too, that it's drinking water quality.  EM:  Yeah, that's right!  JW?: _ _ - DC:  Reichhold claims - JW?: _ _ - DC:  that too - CLM:  Yeah, I know.  DC:  that that water they put out down there is drinking water pure but I don't believe it.  I mean -


CLM:  In some parts of the world, it'd probably be looked upon as favorable.  JW:  Me & - DC:  I think - JW:  Eric are (salaried?) (CLM laughs heartily) - DC:  what we're gonna have to do on - EM:  U can clean your floor with it I bet.   DC:  Yeah, take the white (laughing) (tray off?).  


I think what we're gonna have to do, the city, eventually, is gonna have to sit down with the EPA, this thing like with what here at Ray's Tree Svc, with Reichhold & with the other one down here & some of these other people - that we're gonna have to sit down & tell 'em, ok, when we go into a flood situation, we need to tell u when u're gonna shut the pumps off.  Because Reichhold's gonna have to - they shut 'em off at 419 but that's not gonna be - that has to be changed because we can't go to 419.  We have to shut 'em off sooner & the same way here.  We have to get people that we can contact & say, hey, we have to shut these off uno, not 2 days from now;  we need to shut it off right now.  U can't do this pumping any more;  that's it.  EM:  Sure.  DC:  & sit down with them in some kind of a mtg & explain to them how we're, HOW it's gonna be, WHO the contact person is that we call, the emerg people call & say pull the switch on the whole thing & shut it down.


CLM?:  They could see it work?  EM:  Well, I don't know;  it's gonna be interesting.  I mean Reichhold uses this water for their production so actually if we make them turn off their pumps, they're gonna lose money & production so it's gonna be a struggle.  Um & we need - we need something out there, I guess some, some sort of law to say u will do this. 


CLM:  If they know ahead of time then they can, they can plan for an alternate source or supply of water.  DC:  Well, this water runs all the time.  There is - it just - there's no - there's shut down of this stuff.  They - they - CLM:  No, I'm sayin' if they know that u're gonna require them to shut it down - ChrisWheeler:  Still, I think any time u're gonna need -


DC:  I mean they have to shut 'em off at 419 anyway when we have a flood.  But NOW we can't go that high.  We - it's 405 & so we're actually some 14' UNDER what they're supposed to do because 405 is when the water - we have to shut the flood gates on 3rd St & 5th St.  That's it!  We can't go any higher than that because then we got water comin' in from the river;  we gotta shut 'em.  So they'll have to shut their pumps down.


BUT the fact of the matter is, we're gonna have to explain to these people that this may not be for a wk or 2 because usually the high water in VP is maybe 3 to 4 days at the most.  CLM:  Flash - DC:  Uno - CLM:  flash flood - DC:  it goes up & goes down pretty rapidly depending on that but there are situations when we could have the worst case scenario, all the thing & the Mississippi is high, we're gettin' rain & we're - we're at flood stage & we gotta shut the gates & it could be down uno for a wk or more. 


But we HAVE to set something up with these people so we shut it down.  I don't know what - how the EPA, I don't think the Ray - uh the tree svc biz & this other one down here, this #2 down here, that's not gonna really be of a case because they just shut it down & it goes back into this plume that's there & lays there until they get ready to pump it out again, whatever - way I understand it. 


Over here it's a little bit different because this has got a little, a different system;  they, they pump it some way or another thru air & everything in the pkg lots over there or something, but they can shut it down & they usually do.  But uh but Reichhold is the only one;  I mean it's - it's a constant flow thru there & it's - it's not - it's just uno not a day - uno today it's runnin', tomorrow it's not.  It's not the way it runs all the time & they tell us it's uno it's drinking water safe but I'm not too sure - I mean sometimes it -


11/21/05 LEV - Sec  23 of  24


JZ:  Did u get this email?  I mean I, I'd sent the email to city hall asking them to give, give it to u.  DC:  Uh no, I didn't get it, not yet.  Did u send it today?  JZ:  No, it was back in the 1st of November.  ?:  Yesterday?


EM:  I, I'm thinkin' we probably need some standards & will that come in the O&M Manual or - JZ:  Well, I think the O&M Manual needs to - (we'll or will?), (we'll or will?) describe - EM:  Ok.  DC:  It'll uh go - JZ:  Did I give u -


DC:  the O&M Manual is to describe how we're gonna op this, when we're gonna shut gates & everything else.  We DO have part of an op thing but it's not a complete - EM:  Well, do, do u want then an ord that says when, when the river stage reaches 405 uh any water production must be ceased or any water DISCHARGED must be ceased? 


DC:  Well, I think once we get this thing, I can give u uh info that Dennis has given to me about when we gotta shut all the gates & closure structures & if we wanna do that & then call Reichhold in here & have a mtg & tell 'em we've got an ord or whatever it is - EM?:  Yeah - DC:  to inform them what we're gonna do because uno between the time that we have the O&M Manuals, we may - we could have a flood uno.


EM:  Right.  CLM:  We need - JZ:  Yeah, that's the other point.  CLM:  that O&M Manual for a yr too.  DC:  Huh?  ?: _ - JZ:  Yeah, we can't - we have to be ready to address it even right now.  DC:  Right, I mean we uno we uno we could be start gettin' rain.  I mean we had -


EM:  How do we - I mean I, I understand that, that obviously there's a big discharge into the, the det basin but how do we segregate that discharge from OTHER industrial users that discharge into that storm system?  I, I mean how will we know that they're in compliance I guessIs it - is - will there be THAT MUCH water - DC:  Ho, yeah, there's that much water!  I mean we just test it & shut the gates - EM:  So he can readily see? 


DC:  We shut the gates for just a little while down there down there to test 'em & raise 'em & test 'em while they were there & we had water actually backin' up thru the pipe in the det pond, into the inlet structures at the det thing.   U could see the water comin' up in it.  I mean we've got a flow!  I mean it's - ha (laughing) if anybody's ever been down there, THIS water's chargin' thru there!  U seen it!  JZ:  Yep.  DC:  I mean & uno that - we went over & talked to 'em about it once before & they, they don't uno they didn't seem to really do anything because they have EPA approval to do whatever they do over there so -


CLM:  That's just one of their requiremts is EPA & got another requiremt & I'm pretty sure the others do too _ - DC:  They have some kind of - ?: _ _ - DC:  they have a permit to discharge this water into the uh - we went thru that because we had guys, one of the const guys gettin' dizzy & everything else over that when they were puttin' in the outlet structure in into the river. 


But uh uno - & we ran tests on it & everything & the COE's run tests & some days it was bad & some days it wasn't.   I mean it's - but I think it's something that we just have to uh - ?: _ - DC:  I think once we - CLM:  Have u had any trouble with - DC:  we're gonna have to - we're gonna have to - same way with the, the concrete plant up there, Valley Material. 


I mean we've got a solution to it & uh he looks like he's tryin' to uh get rid of all of his uh stuff that's up there.  Today we went by there & it looks like he's gettin' piles.  Uh ESI was helpin' them a little bit to crush material up & everything so uh & so he could haul it outta there but uh we'll have to see.  We've got a ditch dug & he's dug a ditch up there so I think that maybe it'll be - JW: _ - EM:  Good! 


DC:  we'll - JW:  Chairman, we gotta - DC:  (send somebody?) - JW:  get outta here.  DC:  Ok, we're - JW:  There's a mtg at 7 - DC:  The mtg's - the meet - we, we really had a - JW:  Oh, ok.  DC:  this is JUST discussion;  there's nothing here.  We - JW:   & u - CLM:  Oh, thanks for stayin'. 


11/21/05 LEV - Sec  24 of  24


JW:  I don't know - u might poll the cmte - I - a lot of people might have a hard time makin' the - CLM:  Thanks!  JW:  12/19 mtg - JKB:  There wasn't one of them mtgs - JW:  Them mtgs - JKB:  (It is now or let us know?) (chuckle) - JW:  I don't know if anybody's - ?:  Well - (CLM laughs & JZ?) - wantin' to do without them - that mtg - JKB:  That means he's over the line!  CLM:  (chuckling) Yes, u are.


DC:  It - it's up - it's up to - it's up to u uh, guys, what u wanna do.  I mean as far as that goes, that's holidays, everybody's gonna be gone.  I just set it down here & that's the 3rd Monday of the month.  U gonna have ald mtg?  JW:  We'll bring that up;  I'm not sure.  


DC:  Ok, & I'll uno if it - if not, I can change it on here.  I'll change it on next - we're gonna have it in Jan maybe we'll have a little bit more info on - CLM:  _ _ - DC:  whatever, ESI - CLM: _ - DC:  & everybody uno - EM:  Sounds good!  DC:  will have time to uh maybe go over some of these things with Conroy & Vick James & them - CLM:  That was a good mtg.  DC:  on this Punch List & work out what we're gonna do.  Ok.  JZ:  Ok with me.  


JKB?:  Did they respond to u?  CLM?:  That was the day he said _ - ?: _ - DC:  Oh it's that news, good news they'll get their money.  EM:  'preciate it!  CLM?:  Yeah.  EM:  Good job!  JW:  _, 'Cause u get one, one bad apple - CLM:  _ the Chinese usually _ _ - EM:  Any more on the RR guy?  (U need to chat more?) on that?  DC:  Oh, that's another one we gotta - EM:  Uh that was just such a strange - strange - CWheeler:  Yeah, 'cause the guy - ?: _ - EM?:  _ be gone for a couple mins - CWheeler:  had come out of Fenton.  ?:  I hadn't even moved to town yet.  ?:  Oh yeah -


EM:  'Cause that's when uh the - ?:  He spotted - EM:  the RR - JW:  Right, right!  EM:  had alleged.  Of course the family - JKB:  He didn't have no shotgun!  EM?:  Well, if he did, he's dam_ - ?:  Yeah.  DC:  Oh that's - ?: _ - ?: _ - DC:  _ should have - EM:  Or if - (for what?) he did - ?:  Like we said, we're gonna drop him.  He didn't aim it at him!  JW:  I don't know if -


DC:  I'm gonna call McLeary  (best spelled as heard)  - ?:  _ need a call to Elliott.  DC:  That's the 1st of the month - ?: _  - DC: see whether we're gonna get our - ?: _ - DC:  uh crossing put in.  EM:  Good!  DC:  'Cause he told me it'd be the - ?: _ _ - DC:  end of this month that he'd be doin' it.  CWheeler:  The emerg road?  DC:  Emerg road entrance up there.  JW:  That's (what he told or when he called?) me.  CWheeler:  & I talked to Rick about that;  he said hadn't - JKB?: _ right there.  CWheeler: _ contractor - JW?:  It's on right there.  DC:  Got him in line.  U need 'em?  U need another one?  CWheeler:  No, no.  JW:  Oh is he gettin' another one!


EM:  Boy Jim, that was surprising about Alan Wolfe.  He - JW:  Alright - EM:  uh I always wondered why he was the project mgr on a project that he was managing in absentia basically, uh - JZ:  He was the general mgr.  He's always been the general mgr of the company.  EM:  I, I didn't realize that - DC:  The way I understand it, the way they claimed to me that his family OWNED - CLM:  Yeah, they did!  EM:  Operated.  DC:  ESI - CLM:  Yeah, they - DC:  before this & sold out to Republic & - CLM:  That's right. 


DC:  & I guess uno maybe uno he's got enough money or whatever people to uh - CLM:  Betcha Republic decided that it wasn't worth that - DC:  I talked to - CLM:  much money to Republic.  DC:  Danny - EM:  I, I'm sure that's when - DC:  Thompson - EM:  they said when's the cash comin'!  JZ?:  Yes it was.  DC:  the guy that brought - was the const guy up there - ?:  Got in a corner - DC:  & that's when he - ?:  This guy's -  CLM:  He didn't watch our improvemt.  TWorEM?:  approves the money.  ?:  _ - ?:  Time for - CLM:  I heard u - he's MTG the other guy!?  - DC:  He's worked for ESI for - that Danny Thompson, he's worked for ESI - (end taping 11/21/05 LEV)